Colloquial Cantonese: 呢 vs. 這

Source: http://www.omniglot.com/chinese/cantonese.htm

Since I’m so inspired by Colloquial Cantonese vs Mandarin phrases, I’ll try to review each one from the Omniglot Cantonese list until we finish the list. This will be fun! My Mandarin skills are not that good so I want to apologize if my Mandarin examples are not realistic.

Note: When formally writing in Cantonese, the Mandarin version is used instead. Colloquial Cantonese is only used in speech or when quoting speech. Therefore, I will designate:

(M) = Mandarin

(CS) = Cantonese Speech

(CW) = Cantonese Writing

This week’s list is: 呢 vs. 這

Colloquial Jyutping Cantonese		Standard Written Chinese		English
呢	ni1 ne1	這	zhè	this

I’m surprised to see the Chinese word meaning “this” by itself. Usually, even in English writing, it is generally bad form to write the word, “this,” without indicating what the speaker is referring to afterwards.

“This chair…”

“This bottle of water…”

There’s always creative ways to indicate the subject, but eventually, the reader needs to know what is being referenced. Of course, when we speak or when we want to be general, we’d just say “this” or “that” by itself with the meaning usually implied to the listener through surrounding words or by our actions.

*Claps hands* “This is great!”

But, what is great? Generally, there is a clue somewhere in the person’s previous or future sentences or actions.

In Chinese, however, the absence of a reference is painfully obvious. Even in speech, it would sound so awkward without a reference. Using the almost equivalent meaning of the sentence above, but in Chinese instead, the phrase would sound better to omit the entire “this” word instead of adding words without a proper reference:

 [這个…]真的很好!

[zhè ge4…]  zhen1 de hen3 hao3! (Mandarin - literally means “really very good!”)

[呢個…] 真係好啊!

[ni1 go3…] zan1 hai6 hou2 aa1 (Colloquial Cantonese - - literally means “really is good!”))

The above phrases in bold could mean “so great!” or “really great!” “truly great” or “awesome!”  Notice how the Mandarin sentence is different from the Cantonese sentence because the way the message is naturally delivered is different. It would be awkward to use the sentence in the other language unless the speaker is trying to prove a point. Otherwise, if I heard a Cantonese speaker say, “真的很好!” to me, I would think he or she is reading some text outloud instead of actually speaking. Or it could be that the speaker is purposely joking around with me using “proper” language since we have a close enough relationship. I don’t know for sure how “真係好啊!” would sound to a Mandarin speaker, but they would definitely think it’s weird.

Did you notice that in the silent brackets above, I added a “classifier” 个or 個after 這or 呢? That is almost always mandatory.

Nobody would say: “這真的很好!” or  “呢真係好啊!”

I would call these sentences “incomplete” and they do not exist in everyday language. Native speakers yearn for a classifier to go with the word. (This piece of paper. This pair of chopsticks. This slice of pizza.)

“這个真的很好!”or“呢個真係好啊!” 
Now, in this case, we have a classifier to indicate the possibilities of the subject. At least we now have a clue about the subject, but since the speaker used the most general classifier, 个 or  個, it’s still anybody’s guess. The above sentence is still a better sentence than the previous one, but it is still not that specific and might be confusing.

Sometimes, the speaker wants to be vague on purpose and perhaps the listener already knows what the subject is from previous or later sentences or actions. In that case, there’s no explanation needed. If not,  it’s still better to stick to the “真的很好!”or “真係好啊!”part since it is still considered more easier to listen to with the subject implied. Then we expect a curious listener to come up to the speaker and ask, (M) 什么? shen2 me5? (CS) 乜嘢呀?  mat1 je5 aa3? (CW) 甚麼? sam6 mo1? That question, of course, is “what?”

什么真的很好?                                乜嘢咁好呀?

Note: 咁gam3, which is (CS) for “so.”

In order to make ourselves clear, we can give all the information that’s needed in one sentence:

This + classifier + subject (or object depending on the case)

Now, if you haven’t learned classifiers yet, there are so many ways to identify the subject or object. In English, we sometimes use classifiers such as “a set of” or “a sheet of,” but the only difference is that it is not mandatory in English.  I can say “these chopsticks” or “this paper.” Saying, “a book” instead of “a bounded book” is okay in English without sacrificing the meaning.  In the Chinese language, the listener would still be waiting for the classifier if it is absent or else the listener would be confused.

 In the Chinese language, there are so many classifier words, which would sound weird if it was left out of a sentence. Some people use the alternative term “measurement words” even though some classifiers do not actually measure anything.

Here’s a great website which lists Chinese classifiers:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Chinese_classifiers

Perhaps, I might write up some posts explaining classifiers in the future.

Lastly, let’s take my trusted friend, Rilakkuma to give us an example of what we learned so far: (M) = Mandarin (CS)= Cantonese Speech

Rilakkuma /松弛熊 song1 chi2 xiong2 (M)

Rilakkuma /鬆弛熊 sung1 ci4 hung4 (C)

Rilakkuma is named after the Japanese stuffed animal which literally means “relax” + “bear”

這只熊真的很好! 松弛熊真的很好!

呢隻熊真係好啊! 鬆弛熊真係好啊!

When in doubt about which classifiers to use, try to use 個 (go3 in Cantonese) or 个 (ge4 in Mandarin). They are the most generic classifiers. In my example, I used the classifier for animals: 只 (zhi1 in Mandarin) or 隻 zek3 (in Cantonese)

Advanced Question: Why did I not use the English word, “is” or 是? (M) shi4 (C) si6

“This bear is really great!”

這只熊是真的很好!

呢隻熊係真係好啊!

Short Answer: 是 is generally omitted when used with adjectives. In our case, we’re talking about the degree of greatness (adverb, verb).

I’ll probably explain more about the use of 是 in a future post since I did extensive research on this topic for this post.

My Chinese isn’t that great (不太好) so feel free to correct me.

不太好= bu4 tai4 hao3 (M) bat1 taai3 hou2 (CW – Cantonese Writing)

Chinese Writing Exercise Worksheets

I was researching in Google and I couldn’t find a single Chinese character and pinyin writing exercise worksheet for practice that fit my needs. The other worksheets had too many lines in it (cross-line, star-line) and it was making me dizzy.

Therefore, I created my own templates in Excel and converted them into PDF format.

These are my very own “Chinese Writing Exercise Worksheets.”

They are free to download. You would simply need to download it, open PDF (make sure you have a PDF program), and then print it out for practice.

This worksheet allows you to practice character writing and pinyin right underneath.

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=BF8AED0897926D3C!181

This worksheet is the standard box template that allows you to practice writing Chinese characters without the lines within each box. This format was how I learned Cantonese in school.

https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=BF8AED0897926D3C!182

I’m starting to use these templates myself for class. I hope you enjoy them!

When Learning Chinese Isn’t Fun Anymore – What is Motivation?

Recently, while attending an intermediate Chinese class for five weeks, I felt myself hit an emotional rock-bottom. After class, I found myself depressed, stressed, and with a lack of pride. While it is not my intention to bash an interesting class, I understood that this class experience wasn’t fun anymore and was not right for me.

While I’m always pro-learning Chinese, I also found out that in order to maintain motivation to learn, the learning experience should be fun, interesting, and manageable in a positive environment. Without any of those four aspects, learning Chinese becomes a heavy anchor that makes us feel like we are going nowhere even if we force ourselves to keep going.

MOTIVATION = FUN + INTERESTING + MANAGABLE + IN A POSITIVE LEARNING ENVIRONMENT

Using myself as an example, I thought about what was bothering me about this so-called “Intermediate” class, which I believe should have been an advanced class. It is an advanced class because other students were able to basically read, write, and speak Chinese already. I feel like I have a handicap because my teacher treated me like I had a handicap.

FUN:

Having fun is different for everybody, but even a fun activity becomes a stressed activity when the other three factors are missing: interest, manageability, and positive environment.

My teacher tried to make class interesting by giving us a picture and we had to create stories with it. I was okay with that, but in the next class, she gave us flashcards and we had to pretend we were at the street market haggling, taking turns as either a seller or a buyer.

For me, role playing is an interesting and fun activity, but I was missing the manageability and the positive environment. In the beginning, our teacher gave us flashcards and expected us to have the vocabulary necessary for role playing without teaching us any vocabulary beforehand. Furthermore, she told us we were not allowed to look at the pinyin or Chinese characters when looking at the flashcards. To me, this fun and interesting activity quickly became unmanageable and I had a hard time participating in it. I struggled and my teacher asked my fellow classmate to help me out. The fact she asked another student to pretend to be my shopping friend to help me out contributed to the idea that I am not good enough to do this on my own. I was really determined not to receive special treatment in any way. I felt my pride being damaged. Normally, being helped by another student should not be a threat to my pride at all, but because my teacher had pre-established a threatening environment for me, I was determined to prove my teacher wrong and that I should not receive special treatment. I’ll explain more about this aspect later.

INTERESTING:

Of course, the topic of learning Chinese is interesting for me as the evidence is clear from the existence of this CantotoMando blog. The dedication and time that I spent to break down the Chinese language into manageable pieces is limited to my lifespan. Our textbook in class is so interesting, but we don’t spend too much time on the textbook in the classroom. The fact that the entire class was conducted in Chinese was difficult and frustrating for me to understand because I am not at the level where I can simply listen and understand what other people are saying. I have never skipped a class even when it is pouring rain outside. Once a week, I traveled from Long Island where I currently work to Flushing, which is about a half hour drive. Afterwards, I parked my car ten minutes walking distance away from the train station, and then I rode the subway to the Grand Central Station, which is about a half hour ride. The school is about two blocks from Grand Central Station. I would not do all this if not for my interest in the Chinese language and the class. Unfortunately, with interest comes fun, but without manageability, the class becomes a burden as I struggle to understand the entire class in Chinese. While this is a new experience for me, the negatives seems to outweigh the positives. Again, I’ll explain environment later.

Interestingly, I found that in the beginning we had a class of seven students. By the third week, we had five students. By the fourth week, we had three students including myself. Perhaps, the attendance numbers are telling me something is wrong with the teacher’s teaching methods.

MANAGABLE:

No matter how difficult the class may seem, I plowed through it. Although I consider myself a beginner to intermediate student, I believe there is no task too difficult when the topic is broken down into manageable sections. Unfortunately, the teacher does not teach in what I believe is my style where everything is broken down and clearly understood from a student’s point of view. Whenever the teacher explained something in Chinese, I either have a delayed understanding or I don’t understand at all. There isn’t enough time to process what she said because she would be off to the next sentence already. I couldn’t keep up and my vocabulary is limited. In the end, I felt frustrated and overwhelmed. I can’t even tell the teacher to slow it down since the other students already understood. It was like watching Chinese TV or any other foreign program without subtitles. Sure, I’ll understand a word here and there, but I won’t fully comprehend what is going on. Because I couldn’t manage the language, I wasn’t able to have as much fun or take as much interest in what I was learning.

I have done many Chinese activities even though I had no idea what was going on. I had interned at a Chinese TV station one summer in Manhattan with minimal knowledge of Mandarin and I have listened to Chinese music and had no clue what the lyrics meant. What made me keep going? Was it the exciting environment I was in and the people I was working with? Was it the fun and interest in the music itself? Nowadays, I listen to kpop music where I have so much fun and interest in it and that not knowing the lyrics does not bother me too much.

IN A POSITIVE ENVIRONMENT:

I realized a positive environment is critically important. All the other motivation factors such as fun, interest, and manageability are meaningless when I feel as though I am in a bad environment. I can recall many times when I was young, my Chinese teacher made fun of me often. I didn’t understand why she picked on me, but to me, she’d always be a mean and miserable lady in my memories who was really close to beating me with a stick. I thought about quitting so many times. After all, I was close to being at the bottom of my class in rank as stated on my report cards. What would people expect from a student who was picked on in class? I’m uncertain what drove me to continue my studies. Perhaps, it was my interest and pride in being Cantonese and the fact that my parents already paid the tuition. Quitting is simply not an option in my mind.

On the other hand, now that I am an adult, I have a choice. I remember going to the first class and being positive. It was a good intro class where we introduced ourselves and then we read the textbook. From the second class on, my teacher started giving me and another classmate special handicap treatment. She told me that she is going to work more with the other students because they have already “been to China.” I came into this class believing we would all be treated equally despite our level of comprehension or our prior experiences. Whenever, we read aloud or completed exercises, she asked the “advanced” students to read it first or answer the questions first. I was always last priority. I couldn’t believe I faced discrimination. From that point on, I felt like the class was tailored to the “advanced” students who are going to China again at some point. Finally, the nail hit the coffin when, for homework, my teacher told the two advanced students in my class to create three sentences based on the words we learned and to also write a story. When it was my turn, she told me I can make the three sentences, but if I have time or if I feel like it, I can write a story too. I felt like the way she treated me was insulting and no amount of fun, interest, and forced manageability can counteract this negative environment where I am treated like a student with a handicap. It would be different if the teacher treated us all as if we didn’t know what she was saying. Every time she explained something, she looked at me specifically and asked if I wanted her to explain in English or if I understood what she said.

During the last class, I was also angry when my teacher was holding up the flashcards and kept asking a student who went to Taiwan how to say all the names of the flashcards in Taiwanese. She also asked another student how the names were said in the Beijing dialect since that student went to Beijing. Never once did she ask me about Cantonese, but then again, one time in class, she thought I was Korean based on my last name. I lost my sense of pride and confidence in class.

Needless to say, I have decided to discontinue the class after the contracted five classes.

At some point, if the class is not what you are expecting, then perhaps it is time to ask yourself:

Was it fun?

Was it interesting?

Was it manageable?

Are you in a good environment?

If there are more bad points than good points, then perhaps it time to move onto something else. There are so many ways to learn Chinese. Do not feel like you have to be stuck in a learning environment where you are not comfortable. It’s also not a bad idea to give yourself a trial period to evaluate your motivation. In my case, I contracted myself to five weeks of classes at a language school and I am no longer obligated to continue after those five weeks. I did the same thing for dance class and I was glad I stuck through the contracted five months. I would have regretted quitting so early. Either way, good luck to you in your journey towards learning Chinese. Keep motivated!

Learning Chinese with Dilligence

I was chatting with some Mandarin Level I class students after our final exam back in June and I was dismayed to know that not only was the exam tough, but my classmates were not prepared enough to know the material in general. We’ve been learning for nine months now, minimum one class per week, one hour per class and I worked through the exam, but I guess some of my fellow classmates were struggling with it.

It led me to write this post on learning in general. I really do believe in the learning pyramid. In order to be the best we can be on a subject, we need to live and breathe in that world. When I am learning Mandarin, I must ideally live and breathe in the world of Mandarin. Perhaps, I take learning too far, but this is the way I would ideally live my life. I’ll never stop learning and I’ll never give up.

I’m sure everybody knows that they need to study or immerse themselves into the language more, but there are unlimited excuses that stop us from reaching our goal. Even if I do complain, I shouldn’t complain too long. 

Here are my suggestions from the learning pyramid as it relates to Mandarin. The more you do the things on the list, the more you will learn. Also, if you do these items sporadically, you will learn sporadically. If you want to learn faster, I suggest making good use of time. More importantly, go have fun with it! I might edit this list from time to time if I have any more suggestions. If you know any more that you would like to share, leave a comment.

Lecture 0-10% student retention rate

• Do not skip classes.
• Be on time to your classes
• Ignore distractions and do not be one yourself (students eating, drinking, texting, Facebooking, phone calls, etc.
• Ask questions if you have one. If it’s still complicated, see if you can meet with another student or teacher privately or after class to have the question resolved. If not, do further research by Google or contact others.
• If you are a note taker, re-read your notes an hour later after class or at your earliest convenience to reinforce the information you learned. The same applies to recording devices.
• If you cannot explain what you learned to another person, then you did not learn anything. You need to review the lesson ASAP (As Soon As Possible).
• If you have any questions during your study, trying Googling your answer. You may additionally write it down, email or talk to your teacher or a knowledgeable person to have it answered. As long as you have a doubt in your mind, you have not reached your full learning potential.
• When speaking to fellow students, keep the language in Mandarin (or Cantonese) as much as possible.

Reading  10-20% student retention rate

•  Master pinyin if you are learning Mandarin or master Jyutping if you are learning Cantonese first. Do not take what you read as correct if you cannot pronounce the Romanization. Don’t be lazy about this as it will affect your speech and credibility every time you open your mouth to speak Chinese.
• When you have mastered pinyin and/or jyupting Romanization, start reading characters (simplified, traditional, or both)
• Do all the exercises in the chapter
• Create your own sentences with the vocabulary
• If your textbook comes with an audio CD, use the audio CD as well.

• Read the dialogues out loud to yourself. Try to make your voice sound as native as possible.  
• Take notes of anything you do not understand so you can research it or ask somebody later.
• Review as often as possible.
• You can never read too many books. Every book has its flavor. You may find another book more interesting than the previous book. Read some Chinese children’s books, comic books, magazines, newspapers, and anything you can get your hands on. If the book difficulty level is too high, try to find words you already know. I like to do this with newspapers and guess the words I do not know. If you plan to learn a certain writing system (Simplified or Traditional), make sure you are being exposed to the correct writing system.
• Read the CantotoMando, of course!

Audiovisual 20-30% student retention rate

• If your textbook comes with a CD or an audio medium, listen to it when you are doing leisure activities like washing dishes, jogging, driving, working out, free time, etc.
• Listen to the local Chinese radio station (radio, Internet, or phone app)
• Watch a Chinese TV program (TV, Internet, Youtube, etc. preferably a program with English and Chinese subtitles where you can listen and read along at the same time.
• Eavesdrop on other Chinese’s conversations (without being too obvious, of course!)

Demonstration 30-50% student retention rate

• Practice your Chinese with somebody
• If possible, use hand gestures or perform the action when speaking to help yourself remember
• Mimick other people in action (privately as others might be offended by this)
• Join an acting, dancing, performing club in Chinese or do it solo
• Learn some Chinese lyrics to a song line-by-line
• Act out what you are saying in Chinese

Discussion 50-75% student retention rate

• Find somebody who already speaks the language and try to engage that person in conversation using what you learned
• Eavesdrop on other people’s discussions (conspicuously)
• Form or join a study group if possible

Practice Doing 75-90% student retention rate

• Speak Chinese whenever possible
• Write and practice your pinyin or jyutping. If you’re really advanced, write the characters as well. Do it often. I usually have scrap paper just for this reason.

Teaching Others 90-100% student retention rate

• Teach somebody else what you have learned. It definitely forces you to know the material.
• Blog about it!

Good luck to my experts!

Colloquial Cantonese vs Standard Mandarin

 I can't take credit for this post because I came across an excellent website that lists the differences between the vocabulary used by Cantonese speakers and the equivalent vocabulary used by Mandarin speakers.

The only difference is that whenever I'm watching Chinese subtitles on TV, the subtitles are usually in Mandarin. In Chinese-American school, I was never taught to write the colloquial Chinese way. Even the lyrics to almost all pop music is written by using written Mandarin instead of colloquial Cantonese. That's another reason why a foreigners may not understand what a singer is singing.

In a way, I feel like I'm left out of something really awesome by not recognizing all the vocabulary on the list. I believe most Cantonese-American students are confused when presented with the Mandarin equivalent and give up easily when they do not understand the meaning of the Mandarin equivalent.

Actually, I'm sure all Cantonese-American speakers know all the Cantonese words below, but may not recognize it when it is written colloquially. If you ever check out a Hong Kong gossip magazine, you will find a lot of Chinese colloquial words in print because the publications actually quote what the celebrities are saying word-for-word. Have fun!

Keep in mind though that this list uses the Yale romanization method for pronouncing Cantonese while I tend to use the Jyutping romanization on this blog whenever I can. Perhaps, I will create a file later on with this information.

Source: http://www.omniglot.com/chinese/cantonese.htm